Captain America: Brave New World Review

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This is a DynaMic Network podcast.

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Hi, welcome to the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we review superhero films and debate the superiority between Marvel and DC by comparing their characters in stat-based battle simulations. I'm Johnny DC. And I'm his twin brother, Marvelous Joe. And this past week was Valentine's Day, during which Marvel released its fourth Captain America movie, Brave New World. And we're going to review it. This episode, did it live up to the legacy of the previous Captain America movies?

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The answer is yes. Yeah, man. Shit, yeah. I believe you get your ass kicked for saying something otherwise. I don't think it did. Come at me, bro. You're on. We'll talk about the movie later on this episode. Before that, we're gonna break down the latest comic book movie news to come out this past week. Of which there was none. We got two big trailers last week, so I guess I'm not surprised that there's no real big news this week. But we do have a no-price segment to get through, as well as the review.

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And of course, we list our segment times in our episode description, so feel free to check out the show notes if you want to skip ahead to a particular topic. Our artificially intelligent Duel simulator, AJ 9K, has a quick message for our listeners. So listen up.

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Why hello there, do you want even more from this podcast? Then become a part of the dynamic Duel community on Patreon, where you can choose from three tiers. The dynamic two-oh tier gives you access to our Discord chat server. The fantastic four tier gives you two bonus episodes each month, and the X-Force tier makes you an executive producer of this show. Lastly, the DynaMic Podcast Network tier lets you create your own podcast using this Monte Carlo simulator.

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Johnny and Joe will help you develop your show, provide graphic support and consultation and get you simulation results. Pitch the twins your ideas via email at dynamic Duel podcast at gmail.com. Check it out at patreon.com slash dynamic Duel. Pip pip cheerio. Thanks AJ 9k and thanks to everyone who supports the podcast. Guys, be sure to tune into the other shows and the dynaMic podcast network this week, including Max destruction, which pits your favorite action heroes from film and television against each other.

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This Wednesday, hosts Scotty and Gilly are finding out who would win in a fight between the MCU's Thor and the DCEU's Black Adam. We said that that's what they were doing last week, but last week they actually did MCU's Namor versus the DCEU Aquaman. It's actually pronounced Namor. Yeah, you're right. On the Send Your World podcast, host Zachary Hepburn speculates on fights between fan favorite anime and manga characters.

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Zach is on a brief season break right now, but anime fans should check out his past library of episodes and look forward to the huge episode he has in the works, an epic 10 vs 10 team Naruto vs team bleach matchup. And on the Konsole Kombat podcast hosts John and Dean simulate battles between popular video game characters. In yesterday's episode, they found out who'd win in a fight between Chun-Li from Street Fighter and Lee-Mei from Mortal Kombat.

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Visit dynamicpodcasts.com or click the link in our show notes to listen to all of the shows in the DynaMic Podcast Network. But with that out of the way, quick to the no prize. A no prize is an award Marvel used to give out to fans. Our version, the Dynamic Duel No Prize, is a digital award we post on Instagram for the person that we feel gave the best answer to our question of the week. Last week, we asked you guys between the Fantastic Four teaser and the Thunderbolts big game trailer,

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which got you more hyped and why? And actually we only got two actual answers for this question this past week because I forgot to change the question on our website. So a few people who clicked on it answered last week's question. So shout out to By Dear Bangora and JP from Quebec for giving their answer from last week. But this week's honorable mention goes to Mike Williams, who said. On the movie I'm most interested in seeing due to the trailer is the Thunderbolts.

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to see how they develop the Sentry and how the Void is headed toward being the villain and how they're going to deal with that just being regular Joes and not super power the heroes but as Marvel it'll be interesting. Thanks. Yeah, the Thunderbolts big game trailer was epic. It reveals that the primary villain of the Thunderbolts movie is going to be the Void who is the dark alter ego of the character the Sentry.

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And I have no idea how this ragtag cast of punchers and shooters is going to take down a character as powerful as The Void. But I think that's one of the major draws of the film itself. It's really this colorful cast of misfit underdogs going up against these unspeakable odds. Yeah, like how you described it in our last episode. It's like the Suicide Squad going up against Superman. And that's a pretty damn good concept. Even though it feels like they're ripping off DC, I'm still excited to see the film.

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Yeah, for sure. Great answer, Mike Williams. But the winner of this week's snow prize is Lee Tapscott. With the consecutive win, he said, Hi, this is Lee about the question. What am I more excited about? The Thunderbolts or the Fantastic Four? I think it's going to be the Fantastic Four. Thunderbolts feels like an end to the story. Tying up loose ends while the Fantastic Four is the beginning of a new era for Marvel.

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something that isn't tied down by past movies. So I think Fantastic Four, I'm looking forward to see what's new. Yeah, I like this answer. The Fantastic Four movie is gonna be the start of the MCU's phase six of films, whereas, you know, the Thunderbolts is closing out phase five. And I think there's something to be said for the...

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tone of the Fantastic Four movie and how it presents this hopeful feel and the start of something new and unique and interesting in a way that the Fantastic Four should. They were, you know, the team that really kickstarted the Marvel era of comic books in the 1960s. I think they can reinvigorate the MCU in a way that other franchises haven't been able to for a few years now. Yeah, I like this rationale and it's one that I didn't even really consider because I've kind of lost track of the different phases that are going on right now in the MCU.

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I could be wrong, but I believe the Thunderbolts also ends the Bob Chapek era in Disney. So with the return of Bob Iger as the head of Disney, we will hopefully see a return to form with the MCU. I know that Phase 6 is going to focus largely on the multiverse, since we're getting films like Fantastic Four, which takes place in an alternate dimension. We're getting Avengers Doomsday. We're getting Avengers Secret Wars.

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And we're getting the new Spider-Man film, which I don't know if that involves the multiverse, but at least three of the four films in Phase 6 will, that we know of so far. So great answer, Lee! You win this week's No Prize if you the listener want a shot at winning your own No Prize. Stay tuned to later on in the episode when we'll be asking another question of the week. And when you say later on in the episode, you mean like right now, right? That is correct!

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Since we're discussing the Captain America film this episode, what is your favorite Captain America solo film and why? Of course this includes Captain America The First Avenger, Captain America The Winter Soldier, Captain America Civil War, and Captain America Brave New World. And you know what? Let's throw in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier television series and Black Widow since I think that movie is adjacent to this franchise.

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And you know what, just for shits and giggles, let's throw in the 90s Captain America movie. Yeah, and the made for TV films in the 70s too. All the Captain America stuff. What's your favorite and why? Record your answer at dynamicduel.com by clicking on the red microphone button in the bottom right-hand corner of the screen, which will prompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message can be up to 30 seconds long, and don't forget to leave your name in case we include you on the podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and award that person a Dynamic Duel No Prize that we'll post to Instagram.

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Be sure to answer before February 22nd. And I'll make sure to get the proper question up on the website for everyone who calls in.

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With that out of the way, now let's move on to the main event of our episode in which we review Marvel Studios' latest film to hit theaters, Captain America Brave New World.

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Captain America Brave New World was directed by Julius Ona and stars Anthony Mackey, Harrison Ford, Tim Blake Nelson, and Danny Ramirez. It's the penultimate film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe's Phase 5 of films and the first theatrical return to the Captain America franchise in nearly a decade since 2016's Captain America Civil War. Since that film, the Avengers disassembled and faced the threat of Thanos with Steve Rogers retiring at the end of Endgame

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and passing the mantle to the Falcon, aka Sam Wilson. This is true to the comics when Steve Rogers once had the super soldier serum in his body negated, causing him to advance into old age and he passed his mantle onto his longtime partner, the Falcon. In the MCU, it was really interesting watching Sam Wilson handle the idea of continuing Steve Rogers' legacy in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier television series.

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where he ultimately came to terms with the idea of taking on the legacy and donning Captain America's shield. The big question in this Brave New World film was, now that Sam's made his decision to be the new Cap, would he be able to live up to Steve's legacy? And it's a query that played out not only in the cinematic world of the MCU, but also in real life as fans wondered if this new movie would live up to the legacy of Captain America's films that came before it. And as far as I'm concerned, yeah.

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it did. If you haven't seen the film yet, I think that's all you need to know for now, so I recommend seeing the movie, then coming back and listening to our spoiler review. So here's your spoiler warning. Now I'm not going to say that Captain America Brave New World was as good as either Captain America The Winter Soldier or Captain America Civil War, but I do think it was as good, if not better, than the tangential film in the Captain America franchise, which was Black Widow. If you listened to our review of that film, we liked it.

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You know, we said Black Widow wasn't without its own problems, such as taking liberties with the villains from the comics. But we also set ahead some great action set pieces, a solid, thriller-y plot and meaningful characterization for the protagonists. I feel the same here in that while Brave New World couldn't quite reach the heights of the very best MCU films, it is in itself a good film. And I think a lot of people, including fatigued critics and audiences, are claiming

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that if a film can't be among the best, then it's comparatively bad. And I think that's a mistake. I know we've stated this on the podcast before that quality exists on a spectrum. Quality is not a pass fail concept. Even though platforms like Rotten Tomatoes do actively push that. But like if you wanna see bad, see Howard the Duck, see Catwoman, or literally any other DC movie for that matter. If you wanna see mediocre,

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go see Venom or Iron Man 3. If you wanna see good, you know, see Captain America Brave New World. And if you wanna see great, of course, go see like Logan or Avengers Infinity War, but that's neither here nor there. I don't feel like I should have to say it, but near perfect films are rare, but they aren't the only films worth seeing. I walked away from the theater pleased with Brave New World's quality, and I don't think we could have asked for a whole lot more than what we got here.

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I don't think I've heard anyone say that this is a bad film. I've heard people say that it's low tier Marvel, which go watch Love and Thunder if you wanna see low tier Marvel. That's fair. I think it's closer to low tier than it is to high tier. I definitely think it's the worst Captain America movie. That said, it's not a bad movie. I think the comparison to Black Widow is fair, although I would even say that Black Widow is slightly better in my opinion. Well, your opinion is trash. It's pure garbage.

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I would actually rate Captain America Brave New World as, yeah sure, mid-tier, but closer to top-tier than low-tier. I think one of the best things about Captain America Brave New World is how it handles continuity in that it both resolves dangling plot threads from the MCU and advances the overall plot of Earth's Mightiest Heroes in a meaningful way. Right, it picked up the threads left in The Eternals and The Incredible Hulk. Right. Yeah, like for quite a while we've been saying that the biggest...

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detriment to Marvel Studios right now is that the film universe feels less cohesive than it's ever been, with tons of abandoned concepts, unconnected characters, and loose threads that make things feel hard to keep up with for general audiences. Commendably, Brave New World continues the story of Captain America and the Avengers, and a little bit of the multiverse stuff regarding the end credits stinger. But like you said regarding The Incredible Hulk, this movie almost feels like a quasi-sequel.

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to 2008's Incredible Hulk, picking up one of the longest standing plot threads ever in regard to what happened to Samuel Stearns, aka the leader, at the end of that movie. Brave New World also addresses, like you said, the Eternals with that big ass celestial that rose from the planet's core, which has been a question on a lot of our minds considering that big giant coming out of the earth hasn't been addressed in any movies since the Eternals. Which is a huge fucking elephant in the room to just gloss over. Right, right.

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So I appreciated this movie for restoring some of that cohesiveness in the MCU in that like yeah, it feels like things are starting to come together somewhat and lead up to Phase Six and Avengers Doomsday and Secret Wars. However, despite cohearing things up a little bit, the movie could still potentially lose some audiences I think who don't remember plot points from films over 15 years ago, or who didn't know that Harrison Ford is filling in for William Hurt who played Thunderbolt

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or audiences who didn't watch The Falcon and the Winter Soldier on Disney+. Like I bet there were a lot of people who were introduced to Isaiah Bradley in this movie and were like, did I miss something? Like who the hell is this guy? And why is Cap so motivated in helping him? I guarantee you that is 100% the case and I theorize that's probably why a lot of audiences are responding to this film the way they are. Like this film has the lowest cinema score of any Marvel movie.

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in MCU history. Which is fucking bananas. Yeah, I got a B minus. And I always have to guarantee you that it's because people just have not been keeping up with Marvel. Yeah, the movie also has like a 52% on Rotten Tomatoes, which pisses me off, frankly. I feel like going on a slapping spree with all the dum-dums out there. This movie is not the worst MCU movie that's ever come out. Sorry, that goes to Thor, Love and Thunder. But like, you wanna tell audiences you don't know who Isaiah Bradley is,

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That just means you didn't do your homework. So go get a Disney Plus subscription and watch the six episode Falcon and the Winter Soldier series and pay attention to Isaiah's backstory, you son of a bitch, then come back and re-watch Brave New World with that context. I don't wanna do homework, fuck that. It is a lot to ask. I also think like a lot of the audience is probably like, am I supposed to know this Samuel Sterns character?

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You know, because he does look different than he did in The Incredible Hulk, considering he has that gamma brain now. Even my wife, who has seen The Incredible Hulk like three times, still didn't remember Tim Blake Nelson's character. Well, it's a lot because Samuel Sterns looks different. Thunderbolt Ross looks different. Even the actor who played the Hulk in that movie is different. That's true. That's true. The only one who came back was Liv Tyler in the barest of cameos. Right. These like type of Easter egg.

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callback elements are definitely rewarding for the fans. And not even all the fans, like I would say the fans with good memories, you know. So I just think Marvel's gonna continue to see diminishing returns on these types of things solely because their continuity is approaching 20 years now. And you know, it's not the worst problem to have. DC would love to have this kind of problem, but it is still a problem. I don't want Marvel's problems, ugh. Better than DC's problems. Hey, we don't have any problems right now, bro.

17:12
We're just starting out. I did really like the action of this movie from the Oaxaca fight to the Sidewinder Street battle. The Echo One prison fight was pretty good and especially the aerial battle above Celestial Island. And, you know, the Red Hulk standoff was pretty good, too. I think one of the best things about Sam Wilson as the Falcon and as now Captain America, and I feel like people don't recognize this enough, is that how thrilling it is to see him in action.

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in his wingsuit. Yeah, Sam's not as impressive a fighter as Steve Rogers. You know, his ground combat can't match Steve's fight against like Batroc or, you know, even Shang-Chi's martial arts prowess. But in the sky, Sam Wilson's like, wow, like I'll be damned if his aerial dogfights aren't a sight to behold. It's basically the best thing about the character and it's unique to his character as well.

18:04
Yeah, I didn't love the action in this film. I've seen a lot of people say that the choreography was pretty slow, and I would agree. That said, I don't know if that was a conscious choice made on behalf of the filmmakers and the editing room to emphasize the fact that Sam is not a super soldier, but I would definitely say it was a noticeable downgrade from other Captain America films. They definitely made it clear, intentionally or not, within the course of this film, that things are more difficult for Sam.

18:33
You know, he doesn't have the super soldier serum. It does take more effort on his part to try to be Captain America. That said, he does seem to have a superpower of being able to get stabbed in the torso however many times he wants and still keep going. It was really only like three times. It was like six times. What? Yeah. You got stabbed with like an axe, a knife, like something had to hit some kind of organ. Those things were deep. Band-aids are a thing. OK.

19:02
Anti-bacterial cream, Neosporin is a thing. Just throw some Vicks on that. There you go. Now, I've maintained that the Falcons dogfight in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier television series in Tunisia, that opening action scene, it's really one of Marvel's best action scenes in anything that they've ever produced ever. Oh, yeah. And Sam's dogfight here near Celestial Island. I thought that was fucking awesome, too. Not as good as the Tunisia fight, I would argue. But yeah, still not terrible.

19:31
It harkened back to like the Iron Man aerial battles that I loved watching. Yeah, from Iron Man one. Yeah, I think the Celestial Island dogfight was the actual action climax of the film, because although the fight against Red Hulk wasn't bad, it just wasn't as much in Sam Wilson's element. That's not to say I didn't like the end fight. I actually really liked how Cap just absolutely didn't fucking stand a chance against Red Hulk, so it was more about.

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survival and you know appealing to Red Hulk's emotional state. Yeah I've joked on the discord that Sam Wilson's superpower is seemingly therapy. He has therapy powers because that's how he finished the whole because that's how he finished the Red Hulk in this climactic end battle. It was kind of anti-climactic. In a way but Sam does have counselor powers you know when he met Steve Rogers in the MCU he was a trauma counselor for veterans. It's a big part of his character.

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to approach conflict with reason before fists. Like if you look at the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series, there was that moment where he nearly talked Flag Smasher into giving up her whole agenda before that dumb ass John Walker US agent barged in. And I will say that's a great aspect of the Sam Wilson character, who is a great longstanding character in the MCU with that great history.

20:53
That said, it's not a very cinematic, quote unquote, superpower. And I was left kind of disappointed by the end battle with the Red Hulk, just de powering himself after looking at a cherry blossom petal in his palm. Come on. It was poetic, man. It was that was poetry. Yeah. What are you talking about? No, I didn't like it. It was vaguely reminiscent of how the big climactic Hulk versus army fight ended in the 2003 Ang Lee Hulk movie.

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when Betty showed up and it calmed Hulk down enough to revert to his human form. It also happened in the 2008 Incredible Hulk film during the campus fight when Betty showed up he protected her from the crashing helicopter and then like jumped away with her. She's kind of been this calming influence on these climactic battles and although she didn't technically show up during this end fight, you know, her name was evoked and the Red Hulk had a good enough tangible memento of her to think about his daughter enough.

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turn back into his human form. I do think that the film did a good job of continuing the political thriller aspect that has become a staple of the Captain America franchise, starting with The Winter Soldier. You know, in that first sequel, all the paranoia came from not knowing who was a bad guy because Hydra had infiltrated SHIELD. In the Black Widow movie, the paranoia came from not knowing when Taskmaster or one of the stealthy mind-controlled Black Widows would attack. And in Brave New World...

22:18
The paranoia came from not knowing who was unknowingly a mind control agent of the leader. You actually notice quite a few similarities between this film and The Winter Soldier, that being one of them. I think this tried pretty hard to recapture that same political thriller magic as The Winter Soldier. I don't think it was as successful, but there was that and there was also the scene of, you know, Captain America and his sidekick going into that deep basement where there was that secret villain there.

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Are you referring to Steve Rogers and Natasha Romanoff going into Camp Lehigh and finding Arnim Zola? Yes, yeah. Okay, yeah, yeah. And then there was also, of course, the machine gun battle on the streets between Winter Soldier and Cap. Yeah, I will say that Julius Ona, the director, is not at the level of the Russo brothers. I would definitely agree with that 100%. Which is not saying much, I don't think, because, you know, the Russo brothers directed Infinity War and Endgame. And they're pretty much...

23:15
at the top of their league when it comes to these superhero films. I think the subpar direction in this film was noticeable. I also think the budget on this film was noticeable. This film was only made for one hundred and eighty million dollars, which by Marvel standards is pretty cheap. Like the film is already going to make its budget back with this four day holiday weekend. Yeah, which is badass. I think it made just under two hundred million dollars worldwide.

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I mean, it's still making less than something like quantumania. We'll see what the second week drop is for this film. If it compares to as devastating a drop as quantumania had. But yeah, to me, that's still not that big of a feat, because to me, it just says that the movie was really cheap. And there was a lot of shots where you could see that was the case. Jonathan, what DC movie made its entire budget back in the opening weekend? I don't keep track of this shit. I just read this. This is how I know. Let me go back and find out. How about none of them, except for maybe the Batman? You don't know that.

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I can see that happening. But let's go ahead and get into our character breakdown, starting with Captain America, aka Sam Wilson, played by Anthony Mackie. I really like Anthony Mackie as an actor. We've talked about him before. You know, he's a really well-trained alumni of Juilliard. There's really nothing he can't do performance-wise. So it kind of makes me wish that they would actually do more with the character of Sam Wilson to have Anthony Mackie show more of his range, like really put him through the wrinker emotionally. But I think that Mackie...

24:39
definitely showed he has the presence to lead his own film as Captain America. I think he proved that here. Yeah, like I said, Sam Wilson is a great character. I don't think he quite has the presence and charisma of Chris Evans' Steve Rogers, but I'm not going to say that Anthony Mackie is a bad actor because he is phenomenal, especially as Sam. His main motivation in this movie was to exonerate Isaiah Bradley from prison, a man who he knew spent most of his life already wrongfully incarcerated.

25:08
and who was a big influence in his decision to take up the shield. This go-round was less about Sam proving himself worthy like it was in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series, but this was more about doing what he thought was right by the people around him as Captain America does. Albeit, you know, without the super soldier serum, which was a big part of his arc in that as he tells Joaquin at the end of the movie, when you're normal, you just have to try that much harder, be under that much more pressure, and push yourself.

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to be almost perfect in order to carry that mantle, to stand shoulder to shoulder with Norse gods and Jade giants. You know, that kind of thing seemed effortless for Steve Rogers, but to continue his legacy, you know, you do what you have to do. I really like that, and I think it's inspiring to the everyman. Like you don't need a super soldier serum to be a hero. You just need to strive for your best self. And a jet pack doesn't hurt. Yeah, jet pack.

26:05
with vibranium wings that can absorb kinetic energy and then release it explosively, that also does not hurt. Can I say that I understand the reasoning of why they gave him the vibranium kinetic absorption wings, but I also just hated that he had those? I agree, I totally agree actually. You know, in the comic books, the wings were a gift from Black Panther, but the whole kinetic absorption and releasing was really unique to the character of Black Panther.

26:35
And I think that giving that ability to Sam Wilson kind of makes Black Panther less unique, right? I don't think he needed him. I think he was cool enough without that. Even like at the very beginning with the opening action scene, which in my opinion was the best action scene in the film with the sonic boom, that was so cool. Yeah, that sonic boom was fucking bad ass. I mean, the vibranium does explain why he can do a straight nose dive from, you know.

27:00
3000 feet in the air onto the ground without breaking his ankles or turning into a pile of jelly because you have that absorption I didn't mind that I am wondering what kind of upgrades they're gonna give the Black Panther suit the next time we see him though Or her as Shuri in order to make Black Panther just that much cooler, right? It's not like everything that's vibranium needs to have that same kind of kinetic discharge. It's not like cap shield ever had that

27:26
Exactly, exactly. It was something that was a unique technology that Shuri developed that she incorporated into Black Panther's costume. And then it seems later on into Falcon's costume. What did you think of the blue suits compared to his white suit? Personally, I actually like Sam Wilson's white suit more because I think it pops more visually and it's more accurate to his longstanding Captain America costume from the comic books. All right. I'm indifferent. I don't know. I am really glad, though, that they ditched the awkward cowl.

27:55
from the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series, which was a good call, yeah. The blue suit works too. You know, the Wakandans, they have good fashion sense, obviously. Let's go ahead and move on to Red Hulk, AKA Thaddeus Thunderbolt Ross, who was played by Harrison Ford. Now I am not about to shit on a legend like Harrison Ford. You know, the guy is fucking Han Solo and Indiana Jones and his influence on these genre films in sci-fi, adventure, and even political thriller as Jack Ryan.

28:25
can't be understated. The guy is an icon. That said, I kept wondering how his lines would have been delivered by William Hurt, who really came to define the role of Thunderbolt Ross for me through films like The Incredible Hulk and Captain America Civil War and briefly in Infinity War. No, I agree 100%. Honestly, this film, as much as I hate to say this, kind of made me wish that Harrison Ford was cast as the character from the get-go.

28:52
Yeah, yeah, because I don't think he was bad as Thunderbolt Ross. He certainly was a different kind of Thunderbolt Ross, you know, a little bit less intense, I think, than William Hurt, maybe a little bit more grounded. At times, it kind of seemed like Harrison Ford was winking at the camera in a self-aware sense in his performance. But I really think he sold the more vulnerable aspects of Thunderbolt Ross, especially when it came to Betty, like when she called him and when she visited him in the raft, like.

29:20
Harrison Ford's performance almost had me in tears at those points. I suppose it was definitely a much more sentimental version of the character than we've seen in the past. And it kind of took me by surprise. I didn't love his arc, I would say. There was one scene that he got in this movie that I thought was like truly explosive, like William Hurt's version of the character, like the comic book character. And that was during the newsreel that was played at the beginning of the movie.

29:49
about Thunderbolt's transition from being a general into a president. And we got this clip of Thunderbolt Ross with the mustache. And he threw down this podium. And I don't know if you're like trying to lip read what he was saying, but I was laughing my ass off because he was like, I don't know what the fuck you're talking about. And just seeing Harrison Ford kind of chew the scenery, it seemed like he was ad libbing with all these curse words and shit. It was hilarious. I was laughing. I swore and I saw him say stupid fucking question.

30:19
Yeah, I think that was what he said. That was great. He looked great there. I kind of wish he would have kept the mustache. Yeah, but you know, Red Hulk doesn't have a mustache, so they had to lose it for the movie, I guess. And I think that's a mistake, too. Red Hulk needs the stash. You think? Absolutely. He has it currently in the comic book, so who knows? The Red Hulk was not entirely what I expected in this movie. You know, he wasn't 100% faithful to the comics. You know, he didn't retain Ross's mind.

30:49
I couldn't really make out whether or not he actually had his heat powers. Like there were times where Hila would like a grab a car and it was on fire, but it wasn't clear whether or not the car was on fire because of his heat powers. Like I remember Ross sweating during his transformations, but that could also be rationalized that it wasn't due to him being hot. It was like due to the stress. I didn't get the impression that he had his heat powers in this movie. I think they tried to do homages to that of sorts in this film, like having him surrounded by fire.

31:18
But yeah, I felt like we were kind of cheated of that, especially because in one of the trailers, when his hand is turning into the Hulk's, like it leaves this trail of like burning ash. And that was cut from the film. Yeah, I didn't appreciate that. Maybe they thought that it would require exposition on behalf of general audiences. So they just decided to leave it on the cutting room floor. But I think that was a mistake, because if he doesn't have his heat powers, then literally he's just a palette swapped version of the Hulk.

31:44
You should have 100% gone that route. And this film had so much exposition anyway, all it would have taken was a single line to justify it. This film actually turned out completely different from how I thought it was going to turn out because I thought they were introducing adamantium because later on in this film, the leader was gonna use it in some way to become a leader of the world. And that the only thing that was going to take down his muscle was an adamantium weapon considering its high melting point. It was something that could defeat the Hulk.

32:13
without him melting it. You were reading way too much into the adamantium thing than was necessary. Adamantium is not that big of a plot point within this film and it didn't need to be. Should have been. I don't think your ideas of what could have made this movie better detracts from the quality of the film as it exists. Now that's not the claim you've made in past reviews because you've said that if you could imagine a film can be better or more closer to the comics or something like that, then you degrade that film.

32:41
Because if someone like you could come up with this great idea and the writers couldn't, it shows that the film could have been better, should have been better, but it just wasn't. Yeah, I do that for bad films for which it's necessary. This is one of those films. This is absolutely one of those films. This is not a bad film. Could have been better. It didn't need to be done. That's like saying, oh yeah, then Bruce Banner shows up and fights the Red Hulk alongside Captain America. It's like, sure, yeah, you can say that.

33:09
But there are definitely reasons why these choices were made for this particular film, which happened to be good. Yeah, budget. No, I don't think so. Absolutely. No, it was important for Sam Wilson to stand up to the Red Hulk on his own. I think it was a defining moment for the character's growth and career. I think if they could have afforded Mark Ruffalo for this film, they could have brought him on. They would have brought him on. I don't think they would have. He's not necessary for the story that they're trying to tell here. Let's go ahead and move on to the leader, played by Tim Blank Nelson.

33:38
Now if you remember from our Incredible Hulk review, I'm a fan of Tim Blake Nelson as an actor but I did not enjoy his performance as Samuel Stearns in that movie. Thankfully, none of his character's cartoonish dopiness survived his time in prison apparently because he was much more subdued here and cunning and more of what I hoped for from a criminal mastermind like the leader.

34:02
His power set was largely depicted in his near precognitive ability to determine the probabilistic outcomes of events, which I think is more believable with this character than with characters like Baron Zemo or Lex Luthor, where they were almost precognitive in their ability to manipulate events in Captain America Civil War and Batman vs Superman Dawn of Justice. You know, here, the leader is like a gamma-irradiated mutate, and he should have

34:29
borderline precognitive abilities to determine events. He also developed neurotropic mind control technology and medicinal yet gamma irradiated drugs. I thought it was a pretty sufficient demonstration of his power potential and I was pleased with his characterization. I do really, really like what they did with the leader here. I don't love his motivation, it seemed kind of petty, but everything else I loved from the way they interpreted his mind control to the look of the character.

34:59
I thought was stellar. Yeah, yeah, regarding his motivation, I was wondering, like, why was he so angry and vengeful with Thunderbolt Ross for not releasing him from prison when he could have seemingly so easily escaped on his own at any time? Like, he had mind control tech, and we saw him escape prison in this movie. He could have easily done that and arranged for Ross to be killed once he was on the outside, with probably a much less convoluted plan than what he had here.

35:28
You know, yes, he wanted Ross to suffer and to be humiliated. And that was definitely his downfall in this movie because it just got way too complicated. And I think a guy as smart as the leader wouldn't have needed to wait to be released by President Ross in the first place. It also didn't make sense to me why he literally turned himself in at the end. Like, the Falcon didn't even need to defeat him. He turned himself in for no reason. For sure. For sure.

35:55
Absolutely no reason. You know, he was upset with Sam for stopping his grand plan at Celestial Island But like he didn't need to confront the guy face to face, you know He could have just given him a phone call and been like fuck you my plan isn't over There's still things to come for President Ross and you'll see in a moment, you know Yeah, yeah still leaked the phone call and everything so dumb so dumb again that said I don't want to shit on the character Too much the writing was bad

36:22
but the character I thought was awesome. The character was what Hector Hammond should have been in the Green Lantern movie. Yeah, I mean, like regarding his look, they could have easily gone the giant forehead route that they did in the Green Lantern movie with Hector Hammond. I'm really glad that they didn't do that though, because I've always been a fan of the inside out brain look of the leader more than the giant forehead look, which I think looks kind of cartoonish and dopey. Although, you know, sometimes with the inside out brain look, the artists will render their brain hemispheres

36:52
too far apart and it looks like he has a wrinkly green scrotum on his head. But I think what they did here with the character in his design was pretty grounded and definitely not cartoony. So that was good. It was kind of grotesque, you know? Yeah, for sure. And if I haven't said this, Tim Blake Nelson is a phenomenal actor. I love what he did with the character here. And I actually do hope we get to see the character return. I'm actually glad they didn't kill him off in this film. Yeah, me too. I want to see Bruce Banner interact with him. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that'd be awesome.

37:22
Let's go ahead and move on to Falcon, aka Joaquin Torres, played by Danny Ramirez. I thought Danny Ramirez was fine here. As we saw in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series, you know, he's a charismatic actor, if not still growing as an actor, I think. But in most ways, he was the heart of this film, in that he really looked up to these heroes like we all do, and strived to be like them, and was really down on himself when he didn't rise to the occasion. I thought this character sucked. What? The actor, I don't think, did a good enough job.

37:51
keeping up with the performances of the people he was on the scenes with. His dialogue was just terrible as well. I thought he had some fun moments. Like at the beginning of the film when he was like super excited that he retrieved the adamantium container and he was like, what? No one, no one saw that? Dumb. Like to do something that cool and have no witnesses, I think I would feel pretty similarly. It was silly. It was silly nonsense. Marvel trying to be funny with the comedy relief. It was just not good though. I thought it was funny.

38:19
But the character was never so ingratiating that I thought he was beyond being killed off or anything. I thought that was good. That there were still some stakes there. Because for a second I thought he actually was dead after the missile explosion. And my mind was like, that would suck. So I think my feelings in that moment kind of informed my feelings for the character overall. I'm glad he survived and I'm excited to see where he goes in the next Avengers film. I wish he was dead.

38:45
I just hope that they don't splice him with Falcon DNA like they did in the comic books. You know, they could have done that in this movie where his body was so mangled from the explosion that they had an infused Falcon DNA in there. He just gets bitten by a radioactive Falcon. There you go. No, I didn't need this character. I would have much rather seen Falcon have like a romantic interest type sidekick in the same way that Cap did in the Winter Soldier. Who is his romantic sidekick? Sharon Carter?

39:14
Well, there is Sharon Carter and Black Widow. Yeah, I guess in this movie, Ruth Batsaraf definitely did not fit that bill. Let's talk about her, AKA Sabra, although they never called her Sabra here, played by Shirah Haas. Really weird casting choice, in my opinion. For sure. Like, I've never seen Shirah Haas in anything before, but I was not a fan. Like, I didn't find her believable at all as a former black widow trained by the Red Room.

39:42
I'm fairly certain that her 5'2", 100 pound soaking wet ass couldn't take down a toddler. I'm not entirely sure that that wasn't a toddler on the screen. She was so tiny. Dude, seriously, they got like a fourth grader to be your stunt double. I'm being harsh for sure, but like, I don't know, I've never been a biggest fan of Sabra from the comic books and I didn't really like this character in the film. I think it would have been cooler to see someone like Valerie Cooper in this role because I think she'd get a tie it into the X-Men down the line or something.

40:11
Valerie Cooper, who's that? She's like a longstanding governmental liaison in the comics dealing with superhuman, largely mutant affairs. If I was the filmmakers, I would have just merged the characters of Sam Wilson's Secret Service agent friend and Sabra into one character. That would actually make sense. Yeah, the Secret Service friend of his was named Lila Taylor, and she's a reporter for the Daily Bugle in the books. Also Sam Wilson's friend. She's like his Lois Lane, kinda.

40:41
She like breaks stories and gets into trouble and stuff like that. I thought she did a better job acting than Shira Haas did. I would agree. Yeah, I think that's a good call to have those two characters merged because then you could have had like a romantic relationship too as well. There you go. If she was given more screen time. It writes itself. Let's go ahead and move on to Isaiah Bradley played by Carl Lumbly. Carl Lumbly is great here. When I was looking up his...

41:06
Filmography, I didn't know he has done a lot of DC voice roles including like Marsha Manhunter. Oh, yeah and Silas Stone I thought his performance was was pretty great here. He was super sympathetic You know, especially when he was telling Sam that he couldn't go back to prison. Oh, yeah I thought Carl gave probably the most believable performance in this movie and that I felt sorry for him But I also believed that he could kick all kinds of ass because the guy is massive. He's huge. Yeah

41:34
I love the character of Isaiah Bradley and I think Carl Lumpy does a perfect job portraying him. He was just perfect in the role, absolutely. I was surprised that we didn't see his nephew Eli in this movie because he was in the Falcon and the Winter Soldier series. And Eli is kind of a big part of the Young Avengers, which they're currently setting up with Ms. Marvel and Kate Bishop's Hawkeye. Although I heard that they're going to call that project the Champions instead of Young Avengers in order to protect the Avengers brand.

42:04
Like I would have actually loved to have seen Sam Wilson form the Young Avengers. Why? Because he's a good mentor. I can see that. And bringing Eli aboard. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe they'll still go that route. We'll see. That does it for all the characters I want to discuss, though. So let's go ahead and move into our story highlights.

42:28
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42:51
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43:14
Former General and Defense Secretary Thunderbolt Ross wins his bid for presidential election and gives a speech about ushering an era of peace together. Five months later, Sam Wilson as Captain America infiltrates a church in Oaxaca, Mexico where the Serpent Society holds hostages while awaiting a buyer for their adamantium sample stolen from the Japanese. Serpent's leader, Sidewinder, escapes while Cap fights Copperhead, and Joaquin Torres recovers the adamantium as the new Falcon.

43:43
Wait, Copperhead, that's who he fought? Yeah, that guy was Copperhead. And another cameo, the leader of the Navy Seals who barges in after that fight against Copperhead. His name is Dennis Dumphy and that is D-Man from the comic books, the Avenger D-Man, Demolition Man, as he's also known. Where the stinky guy? Yeah, the stinky guy. Oh, they killed D-Man in this movie? Yeah, which is a shame. He got his own Lego film recently, which I still have yet to see.

44:13
but it really makes me want to go watch that now. You know, I'm not a huge fan of D-Man, but it is kind of a nice Easter egg. No, I actually love that Easter egg. That was great casting too. Yeah, he looks just like him, huh? Totally. I think the fight against Copperhead, as I stated earlier, really served as a great contrast between the type of Captain America that Sam Wilson is in comparison to Steve Rogers. Yeah, I think Steve Rogers would have destroyed that guy in like three seconds, but with Sam, he gets stabbed like six times.

44:41
We'll say twice. We'll say he gets stabbed twice. He still brought the guy down. And you know what? If that guy had a jetpack, it would have been over like that. Okay. President Ross visits his wife's grave and laments losing touch with his daughter Betty, promising to change. Sam takes Joaquin to Baltimore to train with Isaiah Bradley, a Korean war veteran and test subject in the government's efforts to recreate the super soldier serum. Isaiah objects to Sam working with President Ross when he gets invited to a

45:11
but he accompanies Sam and Joaquin to the event. At the White House, President Ross asks Sam to reform the Avengers, and during his speech, he announces a treaty between the US, India, France, and Japan to govern the mining and worldwide distribution of adamantium, a new element discovered from the emergence of Tiamat the Celestial, which the world now calls Celestial Island. When the song Mr. Blue plays,

45:36
Isaiah suddenly shoots at the president, along with several other secret service guards. Sam and the Secret Service chase Isaiah down and he denies knowledge of the attack. I thought it was really cool that they had Sam training with a super soldier and a former Captain America like Isaiah Bradley. I thought that was perfect. I loved seeing him training with him. Yeah, it was good foreshadowing to have that like beast of a man try to hit Sam and like missing.

46:04
Considering that at the end of the movie Sam would be going up against the Hulk. He was a lot bigger and stronger But you know there was at least precedent there that they had established that Sam's really good at dodging. Yeah, he's really agile I really liked the Easter egg that they had with the mr. Blue song the trigger song. Oh, yeah That was a nice shout out that I hope fans spotted because mr. Blue was Samuel Stern's alias while he was corresponding with mr. Green who was Bruce Banner from the Incredible Hulk film

46:32
Yeah, exactly. While they were trying to develop a cure for him. I noticed that I thought that was really cool. Believing that Isaiah was manipulated into attacking the president, Sam approaches Ross in his presidential bunker, asking to investigate the matter. Believing that Sam lacks objectivity, Ross tells him to stand down and instead assigns his security advisor, Ruth Batsaraf, to the case. Sam visits Isaiah in prison, who is convinced he'll now die behind bars.

46:58
While discussing the investigation with Joaquin on a call, Sam is attacked by Sidewinder, who reveals the false buyer calculated where Sam would be. Sam defeats Sidewinder and has him arrested. Did you think it was weird that they didn't have the line from the trailer when President Ross tells them you're no Steve Rogers and Sam responds with you're right, I'm not? I can see why they used it in the marketing and maybe they meant to include it in the film, but I can understand why they left it out of the movie because it was kind of like President Ross's final word, you know.

47:28
If Sam had contended that he's not, then I feel like it would have furthered the argument discussion when really all that was said needed to be said at that point. It really made me wonder like what else was cut from this film and how drastically it was changed and reshoots, because we know that Kevin Feige did have to come in and retool this movie. Yeah, initially it didn't test well. So they switched some things up. I don't know. I couldn't tell you how much was cut. The Sidewinder attack when it happened in the street scene.

47:56
scared the shit out of me. Like I was not anticipating it. I jumped out of my seat because it was just so sudden, like a car accident almost. I thought the actor Giancarlo Esposito absolutely nailed the role, though. Do you know what Sam was pouring on the batteries to make them like emit that acid cloud? It looked like it was bleach or something like that. I don't know. All I know is that it looked toxic as hell. And I wouldn't have wanted to breathe any of that in or fight in that location. I did think it was badass, though, when he put up the smoke screen.

48:25
and then threw the dagger into Sidewinder's chest and then drop kick the shit out of him into the car windshield. Yeah, both of them got stabbed like six times. What is up with you and getting stabbed six times? Are you trying to tell me something? Yeah, Sam got stabbed like six times. Overall, through the course of the movie, maybe. Yeah, for sure here. President Ross learns that the Japanese are backing out of his treaty and that Samuel Stearns, whom Ross kept imprisoned

48:54
was behind the assassination attempt. Ruth witnesses Stern use guards at Isaiah's prison to kill the would-be assassins, except for Isaiah who was put in solitary confinement. Sam has Joaquin trace a call from Sidewinder's phone to Camp Echo 1, where they investigate and find Samuel Sterns, who uses mind-controlled prison guards to attack the pair and cover his escape. In trying to find the words to describe the leader's mind-control technology,

49:21
I stumbled upon an article written by the New York Times and another one by IGN that a group of South Korean scientists discovered that they can use strobing lights to turn on and off brain cells in the human mind and they use it as a way to treat neurological disorders. But theoretically, it could also be used in this weird mind control way. Oh, thanks. I am now terrified of YouTube. Yeah, yeah. New Fear Unlocked.

49:51
I guess it would explain why you're not a huge fan of this movie, because you've been mind controlled by too much television. I think that makes sense now. I can't even deny it. I don't know if that's true. It could be true. President Ross flies to Tokyo to convince the Japanese prime minister to sign the treaty, but the PM provides evidence that Ross ordered the theft of Japan's adamantium sample. Sam meets with Navy SEAL Dennis Dumphy to interrogate Sidewinder and learns that the leader hired the Serpent Society through the CIA.

50:19
in an effort to destroy Ross's reputation. Sam and Joaquin shut down Stern's mind control tech, but not before he gets two US pilots to attack the Japanese fleet in the Indian Ocean near Celestial Island. Sam and Joaquin rendezvous with President Ross, who orders Sam and Joaquin to intercept the mind controlled pilots. They manage to subdue them in a dogfight, convincing the Japanese to stand down, though Joaquin is critically injured. My favorite part of the dogfight.

50:47
was when Sam used Red Wing to hold the Captain America shield. So it provided protection from behind as Sam was being chased by the pilot. I thought that was fucking awesome. I giggled like a little kid with Glee when I saw that. Yeah, Red Wing just continues to be one of the coolest characters in the MCU, I would argue, a drone character that you could like communicate with. That's just awesome. Drones are dope. As much as I love Red Wing from the comic books.

51:14
you know, an actual falcon. The adaptation of him as a drone in these movies is too damn cool to shit on. I even like how they used him in the final battle against the Hulk as like a ongoing distraction, shooting him with lasers and bullets at the same time. Yeah, like flashbangs, that was really cool. Yeah, yeah. I want a red wing. So do I. Ross reveals to Sam that he made a deal with Stearns to have him cure his heart condition in exchange for a release from prison.

51:42
but then reneged on the deal out of fear that he would stop making his heart medication, and that Stearns was seeking revenge for that. Sam questions himself while visiting Joaquin at the Walter Reed National Medical Center, but is reassured by Bucky, who's running for Congress, and asserts to Sam that he's upholding Steve's legacy well. It was kind of wild to me that Bucky was too busy running for Congress to help out his friend. Well by that point there was nothing to help with in that exact moment. It was kind of like the situation was resolved at that point.

52:11
even though the leader was still out there, but you know, Ross hadn't turned into the Red Hulk yet. And we hadn't had the second climax by that point. Do you think that felt tacked on then? No, I don't think so. Does Bucky run for Congress in the comics? No, not to my knowledge. No, he doesn't start a political career or anything. So this is pretty unique to the movies. You know, it does seem like he eventually goes back to being a superhero though, as we'll see in the upcoming Thunderbolts movie. So I don't know if...

52:38
He's like a superhero congressman, or if he loses his election, or what happens there. That's kind of weird, I feel like. Yeah, a little bit. We'll see where it goes. Back in Washington, President Ross gets a phone call from his daughter Betty before going to the White House lawn for a press conference about the treaty. Stearns visits Sam at the Medical Center to admonish him for ruining his plans regarding the treaty and is apprehended, but warns that Ross is still in danger. During the briefing, audio is played over the speakers of Ross' call with Stearns,

53:08
implicating him in his dealings with the villain. Enraged, Ross turns into the Red Hulk and Sam flies in to stop him. Red Hulk destroys much of the White House before Sam can take the battle first to the Washington Monument and then Hanes Point at the Cherry Blossom Grove. Though Sam gets his suit destroyed, he uses his counseling skills to appeal to the Red Hulk's love for his daughter, Betty, represented by the cherry blossom trees, and Ross reverts to his human form. As much as you hate that moment, I really liked the line during the fight,

53:38
when Sam was like, Bucky's line was bullshit. I should have taken the serum. Yeah, that was the funniest line of the whole movie I thought. What I don't understand is why when the Red Hulk arrived in the cherry blossom Grove, his D transformation didn't work then. And Sam was like, dang it, I thought this was gonna work or something like that. And then all of a sudden, for some reason, it did work just at this random moment. You're not wrong. Sam did try to appeal to Ross's love for his daughter when he first brought him into the cherry blossom Grove.

54:07
It wasn't until after he like detonated all of that kinetic energy into the Red Hulk that he kind of stunned the creature. And then for some reason, it worked, I think maybe because he was able to stun the creature and kind of brought him out of that rage that he was finally able to get through to him, because I don't think Red Hulk was listening the first time. But he wasn't even stunned. Like he got up and he was still angry. He was still Red Hulk. I think he was a little bit stunned. Like that's a lot of kinetic energy that those wings absorbed.

54:36
Debatable. How is that debatable? That he was stunned. Oh. I mean, that's what you have to go with. I refuse! Don't be a stubborn asshole. Sam visits the prison where Isaiah is exonerated and freed, and then visits Ross in the Raft Prison where it's revealed that though the Adamantium Treaty was ratified, Ross took responsibility for his actions and resigned as president. His daughter Betty also stops by to visit him.

55:01
Sam then visits Joaquin in the hospital where he reassures him that though it can feel like you have to be perfect as a hero, it's more about doing your best. He invites him to join the New Avengers. In a post-credit scene, the leader tells Sam that he has calculated that a war between worlds is coming. Which was super vague, like super safe. I didn't love it. I especially didn't love the dialogue. See, this is a joke. No joke from you. I would think would be funny because you.

55:29
hurt people. I don't know, something stupid like that. I do think it's good that, you know, how many movies are we into the multiversal saga? And it seems like outside of Spider-Man and Doctor Strange, no one really on Earth even seems to know about the multiverse. So as a concept, the multiversal thing seems late to the party. But Leader's statement was a good way, I think, to get the ball rolling, at least with the new Avengers team that's going to be formed.

55:59
or other people in their universe, like incursions. Other people in other worlds that they would have to be fighting. So like villains in other universes. Okay. And maybe specifically he was even talking about Dr. Doom or Kang since we don't know what's happening with that officially yet. I would have loved a mid credit scene. I think as Devin Davis, one of our executive producers stated, it was strange to have two of Hulk's

56:25
big villains in a movie and not have the Hulk himself show up at least once. That's what I was saying earlier. No one listens to what you say ever. I'm saying the movie would have been better with the Hulk cameo. And sure, make it mid credits, that's fine. I think overall the movie was good. I really liked it. I enjoyed my time in the theater and I think it lived up to my expectations. The film admirably coheres some of the Marvel's best continuity while delivering on, you know,

56:55
political thriller elements that we expect from the Captain America franchise. In all, I'm giving it 4 stars out of 5 and giving it a fresh rating on Rotten Tomatoes. I disagree. I don't think it's 4 stars. I think there's problems with the whole continuity considering a lot of people haven't done their homework. That's not my concern. I think there are problems with the action. I think there were problems with the villains in the story and the way both of them were defeated. I think there was problems with the...

57:24
the acting and the editing and the direction and the budget. I do not think this is a four star film. I think it's a three star film, maybe three and a half, but definitely not a four. And yet you gave the Flash four and a half stars. OK, OK. Hey, hey, I'm sorry. I was young and immature and I changed my ways. I don't think you have. I don't think you have. But let us know what you guys thought about the movie.

57:52
AJ9K, help close this out.

57:56
Thanks for listening to Dynamic Duel. Visit the show's website at dynamicDuel.com and follow us on Instagram at dynamicDuelpodcast. You can support the show on Patreon at patreon.com slash dynamicDuel and joining a tier that works for you, or by rating and reviewing Dynamic Duel on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or on our website. Don't forget to listen to the other shows in the DynaMic Podcast Network, including Max Destruction, Senjow World and Konsole Kombat.

58:25
In our next episode, we are doing a team duel between Darksides elite. So like Calaback and Granny Goodness and Dasad and Steppenwolf against Thanos's Black Order, which you may recall from the Infinity War films. Right. Yeah, it's people like Ebony Maw, Corvus Glaive, Proxima Midnight. It's Thanos's team versus Darksides team. And this was a battle chosen by our executive producers. And I'm really interested in a rematch between

58:55
Darkseid and Thanos. If you guys haven't listened to that Duel episode, definitely check that out before listening to next week's. But that does it for this episode. We wanna give a big thanks to our executive producers, Ken Johnson, John Strausky, Zachary Hepburn, Dustin Balcom, Miggy Mathagean, Brandon Estregarden, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yeaton, Austin Wieselowski, AJ Dunkerley, Nick Ibbonto, Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Spies, Dean Molesky, Devin Davis, Joseph Kirsting, Josh Leiner, Mike Williams,

59:25
and Oscar Galvez for helping make this podcast possible. We'll talk to you guys next week. Up up and away, true believers.