General vs Red Hulk

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This is a DynaMic Network podcast.

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Hi and welcome to the Dynamic Duel Podcast, a weekly show where we review superhero films and debate the superiority between Marvel and DC by comparing their characters in stat-based battle simulations. I'm Marvelous Joe. And I'm his twin brother Johnny DC. And in this episode we are doing another duel, this time it's the general against Red Hulk. And this of course is in lead up to our review of Captain America Brave New World, which comes out in theaters this Friday.

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I got my tickets, I'm gonna go see it on Valentine's Day and it's gonna be a Valentine's date and it's gonna be the best date with my wife. Nothing like working on Valentine's Day. Reviewing is not work to me, it's a passion, it's a passion, so I don't consider it work. Now it's totally work for me to sit through a Marvel movie. Good. Okay. I'm glad, I don't know. But we're gonna run the stats on these two characters later on in the episode and find out who will win.

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Before that, we're gonna break down the latest comic book movie news to come out this past week of which we got two trailers from Marvel. The first one being Fantastic Four First Steps, the first official teaser, and we also got a big game trailer for the Thunderbolts. I totally thought we were gonna get a big game trailer for Superman. It's the whole reason I watched the frickin' Super Bowl this year, and it did not come up. Yeah, DC sucks too much.

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As always guys, we list our segment times in our episode description, so feel free to check out the show notes if you want to skip ahead to a particular topic. Our artificially intelligent Duel simulator AJ9K has a quick message for our listeners, so listen up.

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Why hello there, do you want even more from this podcast? Then become a part of the dynamic Duel community on Patreon, where you can choose from three tiers. The dynamic two-oh tier gives you access to our Discord chat server. The fantastic four tier gives you two bonus episodes each month, and the X-Force tier makes you an executive producer of this show. Lastly,

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The Diner Mike podcast network tier lets you create your own podcast using this Monte Carlo simulator. Johnny and Joe will help you develop your show, provide graphic support and consultation, and get you simulation results. Pitch the twins your ideas via email at dynamicduelpodcast at gmail.com. Check it out at patreon.com slash dynamicduel. Pip pip cheerio. Thanks, AG9K, and thanks to everyone who supports the podcast.

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Guys, be sure to tune in to the other shows on the Dynamite Podcast Network this week, including Max Destruction, which pits your favorite action heroes from film and television against each other. They're continuing their MCU vs. DCEU theme this month, and hosts Scotty and Gilly are going to find out who would win in a fight between the MCU's Thor and the DCEU's Black Adam. On the Send Your World podcast, host Zachary Hepburn speculates on fights between fan favorite anime and manga characters.

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Zach is on a brief season break right now, but he has a huge episode in the works that he's waiting on us for the simulation results. But it's gonna be an epic 10 versus 10, Team Naruto versus Team Bleach matchup. On the Console Combat podcast hosts John and Dean simulate battles between popular video game characters. In yesterday's episode, they reviewed the 2001 film Lara Croft's Tomb Raider starring Angelina Jolie. Visit dynamicpodcasts.com or click the link in our show notes.

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to listen to all of the shows in the DynaMic Podcast Network. But with that out of the way, quick to the No Prize! A No Prize is an award Marvel used to give out to fans. Our version, the Dynamic Duel No Prize, is a digital award that we post on Instagram for the person we feel gave the best answer to our question of the week. Last week, we asked, what is a cancelled Marvel or DC television series that you most wish

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would have gotten at least one other season. And this question stemmed from the news that season two of The Sandman will be its final season. We got five answers for this question. So let's go ahead and run down our three honorable mentions and the no prize winner. Our first honorable mention goes to Scott Camacho, who said. One's, two's here. If I have to pick out a show to go off, it would be the Titans TV show.

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I liked the direction it was going. It looked like it was leading, probably introducing more characters such as Blue Beetle, Damien Wayne. Loved the introduction of Superboy, almost becoming a live-action Young Justice. Man, another show that I would have loved. Titans, Young Justice. Yeah, with each subsequent season of Titans, I feel like the show is getting better and better. It was initially hard for me to get on board with the tone of the series,

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Wonder Girl like Superboy. The show is just damn fun to watch. And I definitely agree that they ended it too soon. Yeah, that was one of the series that originated on the DC Universe app, if I remember correctly, before moving over to HBO Max, which later became Max. The other show that debuted on that platform was Doom Patrol, which I thought was a better show, but both of those series ended up quite solid, I think, by the end of their run. Yeah, absolutely. And in regards to Young Justice,

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That's definitely a show that also needs to come back for another season. It's definitely top tier DC animated fare. Great answer Scotty. Our next honorable mention goes to Zozo who said, So a Marvel TV series that I think deserves another season would be the spectacular Spider-Man. Me personally, I love that show. I grew up watching it. It's the reason why I fell in love with Spider-Man. Um.

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We were missing a bunch of Spider-Man's rogues. We didn't get Hobgoblin, Kingpin, Scorpion, Carnage. And if we got another season, then we could definitely fit those characters in. All right, that's all I gotta say. Thank you. Yeah, much like Young Justice, the spectacular Spider-Man animated series has a whole lot of fans. It's widely considered probably the best Spider-Man animated series that's come out so far, not counting your friendly neighborhood Spider-Man, which is still being released right now. So time will tell on that one.

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But yeah, there was a lot of potential with Spectacular Spider-Man, and it's a shame that it ended when it didn't. Myself, I was always a bigger fan of the 90's Spider-Man cartoon, but that's because I'm like an old ass millennial, and I really wish that Disney would put out a Spider-Man 98 television series to compliment their X-Men 97 show. I don't think that'll happen, but in many ways, the 90's Spider-Man show walked so that Spectacular Spider-Man could run, and it was fantastic, yeah.

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I never actually saw a single episode of the Spectacular Spider-Man. Well, then you can just stop talking. I was just going to say that from the stills that I've seen from it though, it reminds me a lot of the Batman animated series that came around like just after Batman Begins. Oh, the Batman. Yeah. Yeah, there were some great cartoons that came out in the 2000s for sure. Great answer Zozo. Our final honorable mention goes to Travis Herndon, who said...

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What's up, dynamic dudes? Travis here. Shout out to my evil twins. So my answer had to be the MTV animated Spider-Man series. Hands down, that means another season to finish that story arc. Peter giving up being Spider-Man, evil psychic twins that cause him to hurt his friend are still at large. That means a conclusion. That story arc needs conclusion. Everybody will say spectacular Spider-Man or something. No, MTV's Spider-Man needs a bigger conclusion than spectacular.

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And speaking of 2000s animated series, the MTV Spider-Man cartoon came off the back of the first Sam Raimi Spider-Man movie. And the MTV Spider-Man cartoon was completely computer animated. The 3D character models were not bad looking, but everything moved stiff as hell in hindsight. Back at the time, I thought it was incredible. Like Spider-Man looked really fluid, swinging through the city and stuff like that. It was a pretty stylized show that I have a lot of nostalgia for, but I...

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Bet you upon revisiting it, it wouldn't hold up quite as well. Yeah, I loved the cast of that series. Neil Patrick Harris as Peter Parker is still one of my top favorite voice performances for the character to date. Plus you got some cool cameos and like Michael Clarke Duncan as Kingpin, which was fun. Yeah, it was cool that they were kind of establishing a continuity of sorts between this 3D animated cartoon and the films that were coming out at the time, right? Things were starting to cross over in a way on TV that they weren't quite able to do in the films themselves. Really cool show.

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Thanks for the answer, Travis. And we want to give a quick shout out to Matt Estes, who gave the answer of Inhumans. And while I would agree that an Inhumans show would deserve many seasons, I think the Inhumans show is kind of fucked from the get-go. I don't know if I want more seasons of that. I would rather just have them reboot it. Yeah, the Inhumans deserve a show, just not that version of them. But the winner of this week's snow prize is Lee Tapscott. Who said? Lee Tapscott calling in about.

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which canceled Marvel or DC TV series, I wish got another season. 2016's NBC's Powerless, based in the DC universe. This was about an insurance company that specialize in products to protect bystanders from collateral damage of superheroes and supervillains. This was kind of like Marvel's damage control. They only got one season, but it would have been great to see more.

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Well, to my recollection, they started out as a sort of insurance company, but the show got retooled to be more of like an engineering firm or something where they invent products. Yeah, it was products for people who live in a world where superheroes destroy buildings and stuff like that. The series definitely went through a bit of development hell, but the final product was hilarious. I owned the first season, which was never fully released on television. There are a few episodes that the public never got the chance to see.

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And I gotta say, I would love to have seen more episodes from this series. I would have loved to have seen more takes on various superheroes, maybe obscure ones throughout the DC universe. Yeah, I think they had the Crimson Fox show up on the show. Right, yeah, and the Alpha Centurion. The cast was incredible. It was a phenomenal ensemble that included Vanessa Hudgens and Ellen Tudyk and Danny Pooty. I still watch some of the episodes from this series from time to time whenever I need a good laugh. And yeah, I would have loved more seasons of it.

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It was kind of like Parks and Rec set in the world of DC, right? It didn't have that same documentary style feel to it. But I would argue it was just as funny personally. Yeah, I think the show as a concept kind of got shed on because superhero fans don't want comedies about their superheroes. But I disagree. I think this type of show would have thrived in today's environment where superhero fatigue is kind of setting in because Powerless gave us something unique and different at the time.

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Yeah, I didn't think the show was gonna be nearly as good as it was, or I didn't think I was gonna enjoy it as much as I did, I should say. If you guys have never checked it out, I definitely recommend watching Powerless. So great answer, Lee! You win this week's No Prize. If you're the listener, want a shot at winning your own No Prize. Stay tuned to later on in this episode when we'll be asking another question of the week. And now that that's done, on to the news!

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All right, this past week we got two trailers from Marvel Studios, the first one being the official teaser for Fantastic Four First Steps. Now we've got brief glimpses of the film from last year during San Diego Comic-Con, but the release of this teaser was the general public's first glimpse at the film, and I think it probably surprised a lot of people who weren't already familiar with the creative direction that the film was taking. The film takes place in an alternate universe,

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everything looks very dated. It probably doesn't look like how a lot of people wanted the Fantastic Four movie to look where the costumes look like how John Krasinski's did in Multiverse of Madness. You know, here the costumes are light blue with the white trim and everything like that. So I don't know, I think there was just a misalignment of expectations, but I gotta say that I really do like the bold creative choices that Marvel is taking with this franchise because it really harkens back to the

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origins of the characters, you know, as they were presented in the 1960s by Stan Lee and Jack Kirby. I think it's an interesting angle to take the characters and it's something new and unique in a genre that we're not seeing a whole lot of new stuff from. So to see this 60s retro futuristic style, I think is an apt approach for the Fantastic Four. Like if you look at the design of the Baxter building,

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That's pretty cool as hell. I really like the look of the fantastic car too. Even though it drives on the street, which is weird, I'm assuming that at some point the wheels are gonna lift up and we're gonna see it fly. Yeah, I like the design of Herbie. I really dig the aesthetic of this movie so far. Herbie was interesting. I like his like data tape eyeballs. Right, yeah. Just the design of him looks really cool. I gotta say, I wasn't a huge fan of the scene that he was in with the thing. No. They spent, I swear to God, like 45 seconds on just the thing and Herbie talking about cooking.

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And I feel like that was only an Easter egg for fans of the Bear television series. Like they wouldn't have done that if it wasn't for Cousin from that show played by Eben Moss Bachrock also playing the thing in this movie. I liked Herbie in that scene. I did not like really anything about the thing, though. I thought the CG was bad. I thought his voice is bad. I guess his look is the most comic accurate look of the thing with a huge beetle brow. But everything else about him was not great, in my opinion.

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His voice did throw me off, I do find myself wishing that he wasn't wearing that bulky sweater. It almost seems like he's a little bit puffy and non-threatening, you know? And maybe that's the point, because we know that traditionally the Fantastic Four are beloved by the public and regarded as celebrity heroes. But yeah, I do think that this design of the Thing is the most comic accurate. That being said, the comic accurate depiction of the Thing character does look a little bit more cartoony in this regard, I think.

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You almost think that maybe there could have been something that felt grounded and believable and real and tangible within this world. Nah, fans would have complained if you did that. Maybe. I probably would have complained. Yeah, what am I talking about? I will consider myself a fan of this version of the thing. I'm just hoping that they really deepen the voice and yeah, I can't wait to see the polished final look of the CGI effect. You know what I think they went wrong with? You know how they made Mark Ruffalo's Hulk look like Mark Ruffalo?

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Yeah. Michael Chiklis looked like his version of the thing in that movie, but I don't see anything of Eben Masbachraak in this thing. You might be right. Like, if you listen to our reviews of the Hulk movies, we conjectured that the reason that Mark Ruffalo's Hulk is the most successful version of that CG character is because you can see the performance of Mark Ruffalo within the animation. Same thing with Josh Brolin and the character of Thanos. Hopefully, we'll be able to see more of Eben's

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performance within this design of the thing. I never really liked his casting, but I do have to say Vanessa Kirby, at least, as Sue Storm, seems to be absolute perfection. Dude, and the effect that they give her invisibility powers with that slight like rainbow halo at the edge, almost like a bubble, like a soap bubble, that was really cool. I really liked that effect. Cause it feels like she's actually bending light in that regard. Right, exactly.

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I really like the fire effects on the human torch. Those have always been pretty great in all the franchises that we've seen of the Fantastic Four. We didn't see any of Mr. Fantastic's stretching powers though, which I thought was a little bit of a disappointment, largely because his power set and how he uses his powers has always been really interesting to me. Yeah, seeing Mr. Fantastic's power would have been cool. It would have been also cool to see some of Johnny's trademark humor. I agree, yeah, he didn't get any lines in this trailer at all, which I thought was kind of weird. We just got to see him like...

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I don't know, lounging around the house wearing an astronaut's outfit or something, I don't know. And then falling back to Earth in like a slow-mo scene. I was like, all right. Yeah, there were some interesting shots toward the end of the teaser where we see Galactus' arrival, where, you know, in the comic books, as the Silver Surfer came in, the Earth Devourer's arrival was heralded by rocks and fire in the sky and things like that. So they're being real true to the comic books when we see all of these like asteroids kind of come again.

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And we get a shot of the big man himself from behind, really. We see his shadow looming over Manhattan, and then we see the back of Galactus' head, but it's so refreshing to actually see the character in live action as he is depicted in the comic books and not just this space cloud that they did in the old franchise. What do you think of the final outfits for the Fantastic Four? They're revealed in this pretty cool shot where...

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The team is on a sound stage, kind of reminiscent of like the Beatles on the Ed Sullivan show. Again, these guys are treated like celebrities by the general public. But the costumes, as I mentioned earlier, they don't look that modern, right? How do you feel about that? Well, we've seen art of these costumes before, so I wasn't totally surprised. I don't love them. I also don't love that they're not all uniform. Like they each have slight differences to them. Yeah, like Ben and Johnny have the white shoulders and the arms. And Sue has like the white collar area.

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whereas Reed's is mostly blue. Yeah, I don't love them, but I guess they're in keeping with the whole style of this world. The movie comes out in theaters on July 25th, and you can bet your sweet ass will be reviewing it right here on this podcast. It'll be work, but yeah, we'll review it. I actually can't wait to see it. I was a really big fan of this teaser. But speaking of previews that I'm a big fan of, let's talk about the Thunderbolts big game trailer. Now we've seen a few teasers and trailers come out for this movie.

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which debuts in just a few months here, but I think this is the first time we got a clear indication of who the villain is gonna be and what that is gonna look like. Previously, we all assumed that the Sentry was going to be a member of the Thunderbolts team, but here, we clearly see that he is the main villain. And maybe it's just his void persona that is the villain, but we do see this shadowy figure with a long flowing cape flying above Manhattan and essentially covering the city in shadow, in his darkness.

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and turning people into shadows. Yeah, yeah, that was pretty interesting. They're taking a very light and dark visual approach to the Sentry's power set, which makes sense because that's how it's depicted in the comic books. But seeing it in live action is always interesting when you see a character's abilities for the first time like that. My guess is that maybe like Bob Reynolds Sentry joins the Thunderbolts, but he goes comatose or something and the void takes over. If you guys wanna learn more about the Sentry,

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and his dark alter ego, The Void, definitely listen to our General Zod versus Sentry Duel episode. But with the Sentry being the bad guy of this film, it begs the question, how the hell is this ragtag group of super soldiers and spies going to defeat this guy who's essentially Superman? He has the power of a thousand exploding suns, right? He's one of Marvel's most powerful characters. What chance does this team have? Yeah, Yelena literally says, all we do is punch and shoot.

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And she's not wrong, but I mean, they also have a few super soldiers on there. I like it with someone who goes intangible. And someone who can mimic the physical abilities of other in Taskmaster. Although, seems like Taskmaster dies like really early in the movie because the character is almost non-existent in any of the marketing material. Right, yeah, I would not be surprised if the character dies. The more and more I see about this film, the more I liken it to the Suicide Squad. Well, I think the analogs have been drawn a lot, but the concept of a Suicide Squad

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Superman movie is quite intriguing. I think it's really cool to see Bucky take charge and stand up and lead this team toward doing what's right and protecting the city in a world where the Avengers are not really a thing anymore. Yeah absolutely I really liked that actually for a character who could have been Captain America in the MCU and has been in the comics it was nice to see him take a lead role in a team dynamic like this. I do feel like we'll need to start a Deadpool on these

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who's gonna come out alive after this film. Like I'm not so sure about Red Guardian, not so sure about Ghost, not so sure about US Agent. Oh yeah, didn't we do a Deadpool for the Suicide Squad film on Discord? Yeah, I think we did, but I don't think anyone was close to determining who actually survived. Well, there are fewer characters in this movie, so we'll bring the Duel pullback and see who gets it right. Thunderbolts comes out in theaters May 2nd, and you can bet your sweet ass we're gonna be reviewing it on this podcast. Again, work.

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Yay. I'm also really looking forward to the Thunderbolts. We got two great trailers here. I'm super excited and thrilled with the state of Marvel Studios. And that brings us to our question of the week.

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Between the Fantastic Four teaser and the Thunderbolts big game trailer, which got you more hyped and why? It's time to be a DC fan this week. I'll say that. I don't know, I liked the Superman trailer more than either of these personally, but uh... You just wrong! No! You! But disregarding the Superman trailer, we want to know which of these two trailers got you most pumped to see that respective film.

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Record your answer at dynamicduel.com by clicking on the red microphone button in the bottom right hand corner of the screen, which will prompt you to leave us a voicemail. Your message could be up to 30 seconds long, and don't forget to leave your name in case we include you on the podcast. We'll pick our favorite answer and award that person a Dynamic Duel No Prize that we'll post to Instagram. Be sure to answer before February 15th.

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But that does it for all the news for this episode, so let's go ahead and move into our main event where we find out who would win in a fight between the Justice League villain, the General, and the Hulk villain, turned anti-hero, Red Hulk.

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Alright, the General versus Red Hulk. We have two big hulking brutes here going head to head against each other, who coincidentally enough used to be generals before they became rampaging monsters. Yeah, one of them is still literally named the General. Which is quite a lack of imagination, I think, on behalf of DC. Oh, okay. I'm sorry, what is Red Hulk's name again? Red Hulk?

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Alright, so one other thing these characters have in common is that they both have horrible names. I don't know which one's worse, honestly. But they're both pretty cool characters. The General, as I understand it, is a Captain Adam villain who moved on to being a Justice League villain. Sort of, I guess you could say that. Yeah, the General's name is General Wade Eilink, and he's actually appeared in quite a few DC projects. Clancy Brown played him in the Arrowverse, and he did a really good job with that.

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But as you'll see in the character's backstory, later on he becomes a character very much like the Hulk. So in a way, Red Hulk is kind of like a rip-off. Taking this major general character in comics and turning them into the Hulk? Hmm. Hmm. So what you're saying is that the general is a rip-off of the Hulk is all I heard. What? You heard me. I'm saying Red Hulk is a rip-off of General. No, Red Hulk is a rip-off of the Hulk as well. But that's fine, because he's called Red Hulk. Oh, he's an homage.

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That's your argument? Yes, yes. Can't wait to break down these characters and get into their backstories and powers, but to explain the methodology behind our duels, let's go to our sentient duel simulator, Alfred Jarvis 9000. AJ9K, tell our listeners how you go about determining a winner in our duel matchups. Yes, of course, sir. The way I determine a winner between the contestants is by running 1000 Monte Carlo simulations using the characters' statistics.

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The Monte Carlo simulation is a probabilistic model used to determine outcomes through random sampling. In this case, I randomised the statistics along a normal distribution as a way to simulate the many variables that can occur during battle. The stat parameters are based on the official Marvel power grid from which the DC characters' statistics are extrapolated. Additional stat categories are included such as range, damage potential, versatility and perception in order to create a more detailed and accurate simulation.

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The results of the 1000 simulations provide a percentage of wins for each character. The contestant with the higher percentage is declared the victor, as they have a higher probability to win any given battle. In an equitable pairing, neither character should win 100% of the matches.

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The comic book stories have shown that there's even a way for Batman to defeat Superman, so the confidence rate of my method falls in line with the precedents that have been established in the source material. My mathematical simulations are without subjectivity or bias. Feats are not the sole consideration, nor are fan votes tabulated for determination of the winner. Thanks AJ9K! Before we run the simulations though, we like to break down each character's histories and abilities before improvising a scenario on how we imagine

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one of the 1000 simulations would play out beat for beat. And it's my turn to go first with a DC character's backstory, so let me tell you all about the general. Now, Wade Iolink was a four-star general in the United States Army, a brilliant strategist known for his ruthless approach to warfare and his willingness to sacrifice anything for the greater good. He oversaw the top secret Captain Atom project, an experiment designed to create the ultimate living weapon under the US military's control.

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To achieve his goal, Eilink selected Nathaniel Adam, an Air Force officer falsely convicted of a crime and sentenced to death. Eilink offered Adam a choice, submit to an extremely dangerous experiment in exchange for a presidential pardon or face execution. With no real alternative, Adam agreed, and you can learn more about Captain Adam in our Captain Adam vs. Wonder Man episode. The experiment, designed to bond alien silver shield metal to a human subject,

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exposed Adam to a nuclear detonation. The resulting explosion hurled Adam nearly 20 years into the future, during which time Eilink covered up the project's failure and continued his efforts to create a super-powered soldier.

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His next experiment led to the creation of Major Force, a metahuman under direct military control. Meanwhile, Eiling married Adam's wife and raised his children as his own. When Adam finally reappeared in the present as Captain Adam, Eiling manipulated him into serving the government using the threat of keeping him from his family as leverage. Eiling remained a key figure in the military's metahuman operations, overseeing various secret

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classified missions. However, his influence suffered a critical blow when Captain Adam defied orders, revealing military corruption and exposing the US government's unethical experiments. Disgraced but undeterred, Eilink remained determined to maintain control over America's metahuman assets. Eilink's career was cut short when he was diagnosed with an inoperable brain tumor, a fate he refused to accept. Unwilling to succumb to mortality, he devised a new

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plan, one that would grant him both immortality and unstoppable power. His solution lay in Shaggy Man, an artificial life form designed by Professor Andrew Zagarian. The Shaggy Man was originally created as an indestructible synthetic organism, constructed from a newly engineered substance known as plastalloy and enhanced with salamander DNA to allow for rapid regeneration. However, the experiment went horribly wrong. The Shaggy Man grew into

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powerful mindless brute, immune to injury, and capable of instantly regenerating from any damage. The creature rampaged uncontrollably, battling the Justice League multiple times before being captured and imprisoned, only to return each time due to its immortality and self-repairing physiology.

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Eiling saw the Shaggy Man as key to his survival and deployed a military task force to recover the creature's inert body from the depths of the Pacific Ocean where he was last contained. Despite interference from Green Lantern and Aquaman, the military succeeded in retrieving the body, allowing Eiling to transfer his mind into the Shaggy Man's body and abandon his cancer-ridden form. Now reborn in an indestructible body, he shaved off the Shaggy Man's fur and renamed himself the General.

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He launched an all-out assault on the Justice League, deploying the Ultramarine Corps, a unit of genetically enhanced metahuman soldiers under his command. Though the General proved nearly unstoppable, the League recognized his tactical shortcomings in his new monstrous form and exploited his diminished strategic focus, trapping him on a barren rock in the solar system's asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter. Eiling remained trapped on the asteroid for months before being rescued by the Queen Bee.

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who you can learn more about in our Queen Bee vs Spider-Roman episode. She recruited him into Lex Luthor's Injustice Gang, and the General once again clashed with the Justice League, wielding massive ballistic weapons alongside his immense physical power. During the battle, he attempted to activate a White Martian warship's weapons to destroy Earth, but was stopped by Orion and his war dog, Sturmer, who tackled him through an airlock, banishing him into the Phantom Zone.

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and you can learn more about Orion in his duel against Silver Surfer. The details of his escape from the Phantom Zone remain unknown, but he resurfaced once again, becoming a high-ranking member of the Seeker Society of Super-Villains.

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He fought alongside other metahuman criminals during the Battle of Metropolis, one of the first major offenses in the Society's war against the heroes. Following the Society's defeat, however, Eiland was captured and forced into the Suicide Squad, a gove team of criminals sent on high-risk missions, which you can learn more about in our Suicide Squad vs. Defenders team duel. Though nearly impossible to control, the General's regenerative abilities made him an invaluable asset to Amanda Waller.

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betrayed the squad, revealing their mission to their intended target. In response, Rig Flag activated a bomb implanted in Eiling's brain, detonating it. Though his body regenerated, the explosion impaired his memory, leaving him with partial amnesia. Even after his betrayal, the General remained a member of the Suicide Squad, participating in missions that led to events where Earth's worst criminals were exiled to an alien planet.

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Following the Flashpoint event that reset DC's continuity, Wade Eiland was reintroduced as a high-ranking US military officer overseeing better human operations. This version of Eiland retained his role as a manipulative strategist.

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leveraging Captain Adam's abilities for military purposes. Unlike his previous incarnation, however, this version did not transfer his mind into Shaggy Man's body. Instead, he focused on controlling and weaponizing metahumans using major force to combat Firestorm and other rogue superhumans. He remained a constant adversary to Captain Adam, seeing him as a dangerous asset that needed to be contained and controlled. Elements of Eiling's original history were reintroduced, though he remained primarily a military

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antagonist rather than a physical combatant in Shaggy Man's body. Though with this duel focusing solely as his incarnation as the General, that's the version we're going with. Powers-wise, the General possesses superhuman strength, durability, and stamina, allowing him to battle the likes of Superman, Wonder Woman, and Martian Manhunter simultaneously. His indestructible synthetic physiology, derived from the Shaggy Man's plast alloy body and

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almost instantly, even regrowing severed limbs. He is immortal, requiring no food, water, rest, or oxygen, and his body is highly adaptable, making him resistant to most forms of attack. He's surprisingly agile and fast and his enhanced senses allow him to detect adrenaline in his enemy's sweat, making ambushes nearly impossible. However, his intellect began deteriorating after transferring into the Shaggy Man's body, reducing his tactical focus and making him more

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That's the General. Well jokes on you, the Red Hulk doesn't sweat because all of his sweat immediately evaporates. No, but he could smell the evaporated sweat. Okay, okay. I've always liked the General as a character. He was always a special kind of bastard who you love to hate solely for the fact that not only did he send Nathaniel Adam to die in the experiment, but then he also married his wife and became a father to his kids. Yeah. Like, it's rare you see that kind of

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assholery in comics where the antagonist makes things so personal. Right. Yeah, the general actually has a pretty special place in my heart as a DC fan because when I first really started getting into reading DC comics, it was during the Justice League Grant Morrison run where Lex Luthor's and Justice Gang of the general and Queen B and Prometheus were the major villains. I think he's a really cool character. Who would win in a fight between the general and Doomsday? Because they seem almost identical.

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I would argue Doomsday just because of the sharp edges that he has. He would basically smash the general into a pulp. Now the general will always regenerate, but the general isn't smashing Doomsday into a pulp. So I would give the edge to Doomsday. That makes sense. Maybe we'll run the stats on that. But you know who is smashing the general to a pulp though? Not Red Hulk. That's right. Red Hulk. Let me go ahead and get into his backstory.

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Born into a family with a long history of military service, Thaddeus Thunderbolt Ross was raised with the expectation of following in the footsteps of his father and grandfather. As a young man, he immersed himself in military history and developed his flying skills as a stunt pilot at county fairs. He later attended the United States Military Academy at West Point, where he graduated at the top of his class. Ross quickly rose through the ranks of the military, serving in multiple wars, and earning his nickname Thunderbolt.

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for his aggressive, fearless leadership in battle. His troops admired his battlefield prowess, but he also gained a reputation for being ruthless and unwavering in his commitment to military objectives. Ross married Karen Lee, the daughter of his commanding officer, and the two had a daughter, Betty Ross. After Karen's untimely death when Betty was a teenager, Ross was left to raise his daughter while balancing his military career. Ross was also one of the founding members of a secret initiative known as Control.

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which was tasked with monitoring scientific advancements that could pose a threat to national security. Ross continued to rise through the military's ranks, eventually attaining the rank of general. His leadership in war zones further cemented his reputation as a hard-nosed, battle-hardened officer. However, his career trajectory changed when he was assigned to oversee the Gamma Bomb Project, led by Bruce Banner, at a desert base in New Mexico. Ross resented Banner from the start, believing him to be an unworthy weakling and a poor match for his daughter Betty,

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who was drawn to the young scientist. Ross viewed military service as the epitome of manhood and found Banner's intellectual and unassuming nature to be detestable. His disdain for Banner only deepened when an accident during the Gamma Bomb test transformed Banner into the Hulk, whom you can learn more about in his duel episode against Doomsday. Ross immediately perceived the Hulk as a major threat and launched an aggressive campaign to either capture or destroy the creature. He led numerous military assaults against the Hulk.

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overseeing the formation of elite task forces such as the Hulkbusters. Despite his relentless pursuit, Ross continually failed to subdue the Hulk, leading to increasing frustration and desperation. His obsession with bringing down the Hulk strained his relationship with Betty, who remained loyal to Banner. Ross recruited Major Glenn Talbot to his cause, hoping Talbot could both help eliminate the Hulk and win Betty's affections. But Betty's love for Banner remained steadfast.

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Ross took extreme measures, including forming uneasy alliances with known supervillains such as the Leader and Modoc, hoping their combined resources could finally eliminate the Hulk. He even made multiple deals with the Abomination, a gamma-powered enemy of the Hulk, despite knowing the villain's destructive tendencies. His increasing willingness to compromise military protocol for personal revenge led to his eventual dismissal from the service. His obsession reached a peak when he crashed Betty and Bruce's wedding.

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armed with a gun, and shot and wounded Bruce's friend Rick Jones in an attempt to prevent the marriage. The failed attempt led to him being institutionalized under psychiatric care. Seeking a way to redeem himself, Ross agreed to work with the international espionage organization SHIELD on an experiment involving the electrical entity and Hulk villain known as Zax. The procedure infused Ross with a portion of Zax's energy, temporarily granting him superhuman abilities.

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However, the process also left him mentally unstable, and after a battle with the Hulk, Ross was eventually returned to normal. His life took a tragic turn when Betty was seemingly killed by radiation poisoning. Believing that Banner was indirectly responsible, Ross reignited his hatred for the Hulk and resumed his vendetta. Around this time, the Hulk was exiled from Earth by a secret coalition of superheroes known as the Illuminati. With the Hulk gone, Ross found himself directionless, falling into depression and alcoholism.

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His downward spiral made him an easy target for manipulation when he was approached by the Leader, who promised him the power to finally defeat the Hulk in exchange for his cooperation. Desperate to fulfill his life's mission, Ross agreed, faking his own death using an android duplicate of himself known as a Life Model Decoy. Using radioactive gamma energy siphoned from the Hulk and cutting edge genetic modifications, the Leader and Modok transformed Ross into the Red Hulk. Unlike the original Hulk,

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The Red Hulk retained his intelligence, could absorb radiation to increase his strength, and could control his transformation back into human form. As the Red Hulk, Ross carried out missions for the leader's think tank called the Intelligencia, including the assassination of the Abomination and the destruction of a S.H.I.E.L.D. Helicarrier. However, Ross soon realized that the Intelligencia saw him as nothing more than a tool for their own ends. Seeking to assert his independence, Ross turned against them and set out on his own path.

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Ross fought some of the most powerful beings in the Marvel universe, including Thor, the Submariner, the Silver Surfer, and the Hulk who had returned to Earth. He later joined the Offenders, a team assembled by an elder of the universe known as the Collector, to challenge the Hulk's defenders. Despite his strength and tactical intelligence, the Red Hulk was ultimately exposed as Thaddeus Ross. His downfall came when he attempted to seize control of the United States government, believing himself to be the only one capable of leading the nation.

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His plan was thwarted by the Hulk, who defeated him in battle and warned him that if he ever reverted to his human form, his secret would be exposed. After being imprisoned in Gamma Base, Ross was eventually recruited by Steve Rogers to assist the Avengers. He played a key role in dismantling the Intelligentea's scorched earth contingency plan and was later instrumental in defending earth against the Serpent, the Norse god of fear. Ross also led a new incarnation of the Thunderbolts team, a group of former villains turned heroes

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using them to clean up the fallout from his previous actions. However, Ross's time as the Red Hulk came to an end when an inte version of the Hulk, known as Doc Green, finally devised a cure to depower Gamma-irradiated indiviDuels. After a grueling battle, Doc Green successfully injected Ross with the cure, reverting him to human form. Stripped of his powers, Ross was arrested for deserting his country and placed in a classified military prison.

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Although he was later presumed dead, it was revealed that he had faked his death using another life model decoy. He secretly aided Earth's heroes in their battle against Hydra's takeover of the United States, where he was exposed but paroled for his efforts. He was captured by a secret group of shady political influencers known as the Power Elite. Through their experiments, Ross regained his Red Hulk transformation, albeit this time keeping his mustache and gray hair intact. Escaping captivity?

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He resumed his shadow war against national threats, once again operating from the shadows, or as well as the giant flaming red monster can. Powers-wise, Red Hulk, much like his green skin's namesake, has vast strength able to lift in excess of 100 tons. He's nearly impervious to harm with greatly increased durability and the ability to regenerate over time from any wounds he does suffer. He can leap miles in a single bound, and can accelerate up to running speeds of over 100

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However, unlike his namesake, Red Hulk does not get stronger with rage. Instead, he radiates heat energy, and he gets hotter the more angry he gets, to the point of emanating fire from his body and melting anything in his close vicinity. At maximum rage, he explodes with combustible heat energy like a bomb, though this effect greatly tires and weakens him. Also, unlike the Hulk, Red Hulk retains his keen strategic mind,

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with decades of military experience and tactical reasoning under his belt. And that's the Red Hulk. I guess one thing these characters also have in common is that they have an entire history of being an antagonist for heroes just as a general in the military before they became monsters. Yeah, that's true. Although Thunderbolt Ross's MCU counterpart is going to be vastly different, I still really like the take they went with in making Thunderbolt Ross the president and then, you know, having him turn into the Red Hulk.

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I'm really looking forward to his appearance in Captain America Brave New World. Yeah, same. I'm really wondering if they're going to go with the whole like the madder Red Hulk gets the hotter he gets. I think that'll be interesting to see on screen. Maybe. I think the only hope Captain America has in defeating the Red Hulk is to evade and get him so angry that he eventually, you know, explodes, weakening him and reverting back to his human form. We'll see if that happens. I would not be surprised.

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Where fantasies collide and heroes clash, one podcast network rises above the rest. Prepare yourself for the ultimate showdowns in comic books, video games, movies, and anime. The Dynomic Podcast Network presents Console Combat, where video game legends brawl every Monday. Dynamic Duel, where comic-

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Smash every Tuesday, Max Destruction, where TV and action heroes battle every Wednesday, and Sendro World, where anime champions clash every Thursday. Join us as we speculate on the matches and, armed with the power of mathematical simulations, discover who will emerge victorious. Visit dynamicpodcast.com where we settle the debate and settle the score.

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But now that we've got their histories and abilities out of the way, let's speculate on how one of the 1000 simulated matches will go. The winner is determined by simulations, not this speculation, but it's fun to imagine how this fight could play out. AJ9K, what are the rules of our speculation? Well, I should say there are no rules, other than the characters have no prior knowledge of the other going into the fight. All they are aware of starting out is that the other character is a threat that needs to be eliminated. For the speculation...

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The contestants will begin approximately 50 meters apart in a nondescript environment that will have no bearing on the match itself, as no environmental statistics are considered in my simulations. The contestants must earn victory on their own merit. Alright then let's get into it. The General and Red Hulk meet on the battlefield. Who goes first? Does Red Hulk often carry weapons like military guns? He has used weapons but not usually, no. Okay, well the General does, so he's gonna start off.

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by unloading a massive machine gun at Red Hulk, just gunning him down in a hail of bullets. Bullets aren't gonna hurt the Red Hulk. He just blocks him with his forearm. And as these annoying pellets just bounce off of him, you know, Red Hulk's eyes are gonna turn fiery and his temperature is slowly gonna start to rise. No, no, no. These are explosive rounds, all right? So they're not bouncing off of him. They're straight up blasting him backwards. Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam.

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Okay, if they are blasting him backwards, barely, alright? But the only thing more powerful bullets are gonna do is make Red Hulk more pissed off. And once he decides he's had enough of this, he's just gonna leap over to the general in like an instant. Like a freight train. Just punch him away from his machine gun. And then the Red Hulk is gonna pick up that gun and just melt it in his grasp. Okay, well, while Red Hulk is busy melting that gun...

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The general is gonna pick up this massive chunk of ground beneath him and hurl it at the Red Hulk, knocking him to the ground. And the general is gonna leap on him in an instant, just pummeling him into the ground with these earth-shaking punches and just creating a crater in the process. Okay, well, let's say it's not a crater. Let's say that the general punches Red Hulk like deep into the earth in this hole. Okay? Red Hulk's gonna explode from under the earth, out of that hole.

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like lava erupting out of a volcano. And he's just gonna slam down on the general with both fists, smashing him like a bug. No, the general, he's gonna take the blow, but he's not splattered or anything like that. He's too durable. So he's then gonna grab Red Hulk's wrist and just bite right into his hand, crushing it with his powerful jaws and giant tusks. I think the general's gonna find that the Red Hulk is pretty spicy if he's biting into him.

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It almost looks like magma is inside the wound. So General may use his massive teeth to crush the Red Hulk's hand, but one, Red Hulk's gonna heal from that in like under a minute. And two, the General's tusks would now be melted. So he's not gonna have any more giant teeth. And the Red Hulk with his good hand is gonna grab the General's head, like holding his jaw shut, and his hand is gonna straight up burn the General's face right off.

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Damn. Okay. Well, I mean, the general feels pain, so this will hurt him for sure. But while Red Hulk is grabbing the general's face, that's when the general is just going to whip out this massive knife that he was concealing in his pants. Well, I just slash it right across the Red Hulk's abdomen, which, you know, will take Red Hulk back and cause him to let go of the general's face, which instantly regenerates like tusks and all. What is this knife made out of that would slash the Red Hulk? Is it an adamantium knife?

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I don't fucking know, Prometheum. The general has like all kinds of high tech weaponry. Okay, whatever, if I grant you this, the Red Hulk is just gonna shrug off the slash wound as it heals on his body, and he's gonna break the general's arm and snatch that knife right from him. And Red Hulk, as he's holding the knife, he's gonna use his heat generation to superheat the blade so that it's glowing red hot. So basically it's like the Red Hulk is holding a lightsaber now.

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like a short lightsaber. And he's gonna use that red hot blade to just stab the general right through the heart. And then he's gonna move the blade upward to just bisect the top half of the general's body, including his head just right in half. Cool, and right after that, these purple tendrils shoot between the general's two halves and pull his body back together, like healing him instantly, along with his broken arm. Now you've made the general angry. You're not gonna like him when he's angry because now he's gonna...

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just backhand that blade right out of Red Hulk's hand and then grapple him into this headlock and just bite his whole damn head right off his body. Match over. How is he gonna bite? What about the temperature thing? He's too hot to bite. He's gonna burn his mouth right off. Dude, the general can instantly recover from heartburn. All right, if that happens, the simple act of the general, like, chomping down his teeth on the Red Hulk's head, about to crush it in his molars, that is gonna set the Red Hulk off.

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and infuriate Red Hulk so much that he's gonna burst into flames inside the General's mouth and then Red Hulk is gonna explode like a high-yield bomb and it's gonna create this big fireball explosion like a little mushroom cloud and that explosion is gonna be so strong that it's gonna blast the General right off the Red Hulk and it's gonna send the General rolling through the atmosphere into orbit where, you know, he's just gonna float in space.

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in the empty void until he's eventually pulled into a black hole. Match over. That is the most convoluted finishing move in the history of this podcast, I feel like. I think in reality, the general would simply bite the Red Hulk's head off before he had a chance to explode. So actually, Red Hulk's body is cold and lifeless on the floor. No, I think the black hole route is the better way to go. For sure. For sure. It's a weird way to go.

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I mean, you can't really hurt the general. So what else am I going to do? That's fair. Let's leave it there. Either the general gets knocked into a black hole or the red Hulk gets his head bitten off. Let's run the stats. 89k hit it. Inputting data, running calculations, processing results, simulations complete. This was a solid matchup. When the executive producers first pitched this as an idea, I think it was Devin Davis.

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Although I don't want to not give Miggy credit if he pitched this. It was one of the executive producers who said the general should go against the Red Hulk. And I was super excited at the time when I heard it and the match did not disappoint because the stats on these guys were not only off the charts, but also pretty close. Yeah, I remember when I first heard about this match, I was like, sold, sold, sold, sold. Hey, stop. I could only be so sold. Obviously, we said that the general was more durable than the Red Hulk.

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because he's just a whole lot more regenerative. That's his whole thing. The Red Hulk also has a healing factor, but it's a lot slower than the Generals, which is almost instantaneous. Yeah, we also gave the General a slight leg up when it came to range, because he often carries firearms with him in battle. But because of the Red Hulk's energy that he emanates from his body, we said that he was higher in the damage level category. We also said Red Hulk is smarter than the General.

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Right, we determined that General Wade Eiling is as intelligent as Thunderbolt Ross, but after Wade Eiling transferred his body into the Shaggy Man, he became less intelligent. I guess the General also has the ability to detect adrenaline, so he got a leg up in the perception category. But everything else, from speed to strength to evasiveness to fighting skill, these guys were identical. Right, so taking all of that into account, Joseph, who do you think came out on top?

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I'm gonna give it to my boy the Red Hulk. I think these guys are pretty evenly matched, but I'm not gonna say that the general's gonna win. I'm not some kind of punk ass. What? Well, I guess Instagram agrees with you. They also don't wanna apparently be punk asses because 85% voted in favor of Red Hulk in the poll that we posted. It's about time Marvel wins one of these polls. I'm really glad that it was like a landslide. I'm just gonna chalk it up to the fact that Red Hulk is.

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appearing in a movie that's being released this week. And yeah, no one knows who the general is though either. Yeah, people may know Wade Eiling, but odds are they probably don't know the monster version of him. But do the simulation results match the poll? Let's find out. AG9K, the results please. Hey, Yuasa. The winner of the matchup between the general and Red Hulk is... Red Hulk. I knew it! I knew it! I called it! I called it, Ben.

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but not by much. He won 543 of the 1000 matches, or 54.3% of the time compared to the general who won 45.7% of the simulated matches. It makes sense, like you would always just knock him into space and then get him sucked into a black hole, right? So dumb, so dumb. Ha ha ha ha ha.

53:29
I guess a better way would be that he just gets so hot that the general incinerates into atoms basically and can't reform from that or something. That seems like a more plausible explanation to me than whatever you came up with. Let's go with that, okay. It looks like the Red Hulk came out on top primarily because of the intelligence stat. That was the biggest discrepancy between the two characters, which is kind of.

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heartbreaking because DC didn't need to make the general dumber when he went to Shaggyman's body. They just needed to figure a way for the Justice League to outsmart him essentially. I think it makes sense. I think it totally makes sense. The Red Hulk is not only powerful, but also very strategic. I think it's dumb that Marvel would not have him turn into a monstrous brute mentally like the Hulk. Like why do that? Why make Red Hulk better than the Hulk?

54:25
Well, he's not better than the Hulk in that if he gets too angry, he explodes and then gets weaker. If Green Hulk gets too angry, he becomes so strong that he can't lose. So ultimately, yeah, Green Hulk is still better than Red Hulk in my mind. I'm so glad that my voice made it through this episode. Oh yeah, I'm not. At all. What? Cause I hate your voice! But that does it for this duel, AJ9K help close us out.

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Thanks for listening to Dynamic Duel. Visit the show's website at dynamicDuel.com and follow us on Instagram at dynamicDuelpodcast. You can support the show on Patreon at patreon.com slash dynamicDuel and joining a tier that works for you, or by rating and reviewing Dynamic Duel on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or on our website. Don't forget to listen to the other shows in the Dynamite Podcast Network, including Max Destruction, Senjow World and Console Combat.

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Alright guys, as we mentioned before, our next episode is going to be a review of Captain America Brave New World. I already got my tickets, as I mentioned, and I'm really looking forward to seeing the movie. Jonathan, do you have your tickets yet? Hell no! You better fix that shit. You better get on that. Same with you, the listener. You want to see this movie in theaters. Don't be some lame-o who sees it only on their small-ass television. That's not nearly as big as a movie theater screen. I was gonna say, hey, hey, hey.

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My television's not small, but then compared to a movie screen. Anyway. But that does it for this episode, we want to give a big thanks to our executive producers Ken Johnson, John Storosky, Zachary Hepburn, Dustin Belcombe, Mickey Matten-Geehan, Brandon Estergard, Nathaniel Wagner, Levi Yeaton, Austin Wazilowski, AJ Dunkerley, Scott Camacho, Gil Camacho, Adam Spies, Dean Maleski, Devin Davis, Joseph Kirsting, Josh Leiner, Mike Williams, and Oscar Galvez for helping make this podcast possible. And we'll talk to you guys next week.

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Up, up and away, true believers. The angrier I get, the hotter I get, but not in the temperature sense. I mean it in the damn that AI is sexy kind of sense.